Tottenham’s Martin Jol vs Everton’s David Moyes: Who Would You Rather Have?
September 12, 2007
Two Men Enter is a new CaughtOffside feature, where we’ll pit folks against each other and ask you, the readers, to determine who comes out on top. This time it’s two of the Premier League’s promising young gaffers going head to head.
CaughtOffside Needs Your Help!
Inspired by Steve McClown’s patriotic battle-cry of “GET IN THEIR FACES LADS!” we’ve got all aggressive. Its blahhrdy International Week though so aside from beating each other up in the COS office their isn’t much to get the aggression out, so instead a hypothetical between two up and coming Premier League managers seemed a better idea.
We originally had this as a fist fight, but it wouldn’t be fair unless we allowed groin shots which is pretty much all Moyes could use to bring down the ogre that is Martin Jol.
In the Blue corner we have David Moyes, manager of the “People’s Club” Everton FC since 2002, he has systematically culled countless dead weight players, whilst actually bringing in some bargains too, like Cahill and Arteta (we won’t mention the nightmare signings of Kroldrup and Beattie). At the same time Moyes has pushed Everton’s progress to the other side of the League table, his finest hour so far has been to secure a Champions League spot (only to crash out to eventual semi-finalists Villareal). Moyes’ record against Spurs hadn’t set the world alight until last year, and they now have back to back away victories at “The Lane”. Recently Moyes has started to even splash the cash, bringing in Andy Johnson and Yakubu for hefty fees. The poster boy for patience and faith in a “five year plan”
In the Lilywhite corner is Tottenham manager Martin Jol, the poster boy for lack of patience and faith in a “five year plan”. He has consistently threatened to shatter the glass ceiling and move into the Champions League places. Jol’s job security is tracing paper thin these days, thanks to an impromptu Spurs board field-trip to see Sevilla’s Juande Ramos, but would we even be having this debate if it wasn’t for some rancid lasagnas? What has been arguably most impressive about Jol’s reign is his constant impressive acquisitions - making for a very impressive, and young squad, he improved them further this summer. And lest we forget, Spurs had an atrocious start to last year’s Premier League, so all is not lost!
So if you had to pick one of the two to manage your club, who would it be and why?
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116 Responses to “Tottenham’s Martin Jol vs Everton’s David Moyes: Who Would You Rather Have?”
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Moyes is better by far.
There is no doubt - Moyes every time. Jol has had far more money than Moyes and has never had the stability that Everton have had. He hasnt had the hardship that Moyes had at Everton with clearing out the deadwood, and rebuilding a side capable of challenging in europe. Hes more “good buys” than Jol, who i believe has only had Berbatov as world class buy, along with a couple of other good purchases. However, Moyes with longer in the job has bought Cahill, Arteta, Johnson, Lescott, Howard and loanees like Fernandes and Gravesen really show his astuteness as a manager.
The decision is therefore too easy to make:
Moyes.
Easy. Moyes all day long. He’s achieved more on a shoe string budget than Martin Job has achieved with a budget sufficient to clear the debt of a small African country.
Martin Jol wouldn’t even get a job selling burgers at Goodison under Moyes.
Anyone can buy big in the hope of making a team successful, but the sign of a good manager is one who creates a team of players who compliment eachother to get the best out of his signings.
As much as I like Jol, then the answer has to be Moyes every time as he has created a very solid team with limited funds over the last few seasons, where Jol has created a capable but inconsistent team with, its fair to say, a fairly large budget!!
Gaz,
Not only are you illiterate (as most scousers are) but you are also stupid.
According to you, Jol “hasnt had the hardship that Moyes had at Everton with clearing out the deadwood, and rebuilding a side capable of challenging in europe.”
WHY? When Jol took over we had a totally mediocre squad - none of whom are playing today. Is that not rebuilding or clearing out?
What a twat. Get a job.
OOOH Faggots, Touched a Cockney nerve there???
Illiterate rates are higher in the London area than anywhere else in the country, as is, and get this unemployment, also car theft and burglary, street crime is also much higher in the London are than in the North West…
So let me put this to you… you are a scum bag shandy drinking southerner.
Moyes sh*ts all over Jol any day…
Faggots, you’re a shit joke
[quote comment=”61538″]Gaz,
Not only are you illiterate (as most scousers are) but you are also stupid.
According to you, Jol “hasnt had the hardship that Moyes had at Everton with clearing out the deadwood, and rebuilding a side capable of challenging in europe.”
WHY? When Jol took over we had a totally mediocre squad - none of whom are playing today. Is that not rebuilding or clearing out?
What a twat. Get a job.[/quote]
There’s always one tosser who has to start with the abuse. Sorry Faggots but you are the only twat here…….
jol everytime. moyes never ever ever ever stops moaning, its so fecking annoying.
plus spurs easily play the more attractive football, they dont have to strangle the life out of a game to get a result.
its worth remembering how poor the premiership was the season when everton came forth. the last 2 years were a little better and spurs came out on top and of course should have had 4th until lasagna-gate.
Good question and not an easy to give an answer. I’m a spurs fan and as much as everton fans will deny the spurs hotseat is a far bigger job. Contrary to peoples thoughts Jol is not the man responsible for the purchases. This job is down to our sporting director. Jol’s job is to coach the team and coach it he has done. 5th twice in two seasons.
Moyes on the other hand has no pressure to succeed, at least not that which Jol has to work with. He has done a fantastic job at Everton and no one could deny this but i think you are comparing two completely different managerial positions. I believe both managers over the past couple of season have done fantastically well in their own right.
[quote comment=”61538″]Gaz,
Not only are you illiterate (as most scousers are) but you are also stupid.
According to you, Jol “hasnt had the hardship that Moyes had at Everton with clearing out the deadwood, and rebuilding a side capable of challenging in europe.”
WHY? When Jol took over we had a totally mediocre squad - none of whom are playing today. Is that not rebuilding or clearing out?
What a twat. Get a job.[/quote]
sorry mrs jol
And here’s me thinking Faggots would come out with something worthwhile.
Anon….. “sorry Mrs JOl”
You are a typical moron with nothing but crap spouting out your hole!
[quote comment=”61549″]Good question and not an easy to give an answer. I’m a spurs fan and as much as everton fans will deny the spurs hotseat is a far bigger job. Contrary to peoples thoughts Jol is not the man responsible for the purchases. This job is down to our sporting director. Jol’s job is to coach the team and coach it he has done. 5th twice in two seasons.
Moyes on the other hand has no pressure to succeed, at least not that which Jol has to work with. He has done a fantastic job at Everton and no one could deny this but i think you are comparing two completely different managerial positions. I believe both managers over the past couple of season have done fantastically well in their own right.[/quote]
everton share a city with the most succesful club in english footy….with the fans with the biggest gobs…spurs manager isnt the tougher job of the two, or it wouldnt be if the spurs board didnt sack everyone after a couple of defeats
its a good question but Martin Jol has a much harder job because not only is his brief to build a team capable of challenging but he also has to buy footballers that could be sold on at a profit if requested so he dosnt have the luxury of buying players just for today like the very good journeyman players that have served Everton so well. I also think that the spurs team of say 2009/2010 will be miles ahead of the Everton team although this is very hard to prove and only time will prove me right
Well said, Phil. Here here.
Has to be Jol. Lets not forget Everton were above Spurs before Jol took over and sibce then Spurs have always finished higher.
Jol also plays far better football than Moyes and has been more succesful in the cups.
Rui coster, you plum; Jol doesn’t buy players just for today. What does every good manager do? He plans for the future. Can you spell football coz you know frig all about it lad.
[quote comment=”61555″]Anon….. “sorry Mrs JOl”
You are a typical moron with nothing but crap spouting out your hole![/quote]
ooops - sorry…..youre mrs jol arent you?
Rui Coster,
2009/2010? Hmmm….I can see where you are coming from with the spuds young players but what about Baines, Lescott, Yakubu, Arteta, Yobo, Vaughan - they will all be top, top players in their prime by then (assuming we don’t sell them all!) and perhaps you havn’t heard of Jose Baxter………..As the name says, Rooney who?
Editor: Removed. Idiot.
Didn’t we have this debate a few days ago? Bit boring to bring it all up again.
Faggots and Phil
You both sound nice together…
Like a big juicy pair of tits!!!
Bill Vector - All your other incessant drivel on this board is so interesting then is it? You cunt
[quote comment=”61551″][quote comment=”61538″]Gaz,
Not only are you illiterate (as most scousers are) but you are also stupid.
According to you, Jol “hasnt had the hardship that Moyes had at Everton with clearing out the deadwood, and rebuilding a side capable of challenging in europe.”
WHY? When Jol took over we had a totally mediocre squad - none of whom are playing today. Is that not rebuilding or clearing out?
What a twat. Get a job.[/quote]
sorry mrs jol[/quote]
No Wonder your are down as anonymous, what a pathetic and immature reponse !! (Tottenham Supporter by any chance???)
Jol inherited a mediocre squad and has replaced it with another one. Do you think that rabble of over priced southern puffs will challenge for anything?
Darren Bent 16.5m what a joke, Gareth Bale 10m (i think), Jenas 9m. Lets compare that to Johnson 8.5m, Lescott 5m, Cahill 2.5m
I know who i would rather have, and for nearly 20m less…
Spurs fans make me laugh. Do you not realise how deluded you all are? If you actually believe Jol has acheived more then you do not know football. Think how much money you lot have spent. You are among the biggest spenders since the Premiership began. You have spent over £100 million just on players who cost more than £5million since 2000. Martin Jol has spent loads of money since taking charge:
Darren Bent £16,500,000
Dimitar Berbatov £10,900,000
Gareth Bale £10,000,000
Didier Zokora £8,200,000
Younes Kaboul £8,200,000
Dean Richards £8,100,000
Jermaine Jenas £7,000,000
Pascal Chimbonda £5,500,000
Kevin Boateng £5,400,000
Moyes doesn’t have the same luxury that Jol has had. If Moyes spent the same money there would be pressure on him to deliver Champions League football. This is the pressure that the Spurs board have quite rightly put on Jol. If you spend all that money (regardless of whether all those signings were Jol’s choice or Commoli/Kemsley’s choice) then you really should be playing acheiving top 4 finishes. The problem with Spurs is that the players are all mercenaries who think about themselves first and foremost. Just look at Berbatov and Chimbonda piping up and moaning every time things don’t go their way. Spurs do not play for eachother and Jol has failed to cultivate a proper team spirit at Spurs. Moyes has instilled belief and a camaraderie amongst the Everton players. Maybe the Spurs board should take a leaf out of the Everton book and look to emulate what Moyes has acheived. I firmly believe that Moyes is the blueprint for a new wave of british managers who are trying to copy the Moyes methodology by building good teams with very little cash and creating a real team spirit. Look at Hughes at Blackburn and thats a fine example of someone who has gone about management in a similar way to Moyes.
Jol better than Moyes. You’re having a laugh. Oh, and you lot will get stuffed by Fabregas and co on the weekend.
[quote comment=”61559″]its a good question but Martin Jol has a much harder job because not only is his brief to build a team capable of challenging but he also has to buy footballers that could be sold on at a profit if requested so he dosnt have the luxury of buying players just for today like the very good journeyman players that have served Everton so well. I also think that the spurs team of say 2009/2010 will be miles ahead of the Everton team although this is very hard to prove and only time will prove me right[/quote]
What a load of rubbish - you look at the average age of the Everton squad that Moyes has built over the last 3 year. Its a squad for the future - journeyman players, you couldn’t be further from the truth - Howard, Yobo, Baines, Cahill, Lesscot, Jags, Arteta, McFadden, Johnson, Yakubu.
I am more than looking forward to 2009/10 as all the players named above will only just be getting near to their prime, along with another two or three of Moyes choice buys. More than happy to take the Pepsi challenge against Spur come 2009/10
As to the Spurs job having more pressure becasue its a bigger job. What a load a rubbish - I admit Everton have been in the daldrums over the last 10-13 year - But even in this ‘poor’ period of the clubs History we have still managed a FA cup win and a 4th Place finish in the Prem, and Spurs have done what other than spend loads of money?. Spurs a bigger club than Everton- How on earth can you work that one out?????
Much rather Moyes than Jol
“but would we even be having this debate if it wasn’t for some rancid lasagnas?”
Or consistently throwing the lead away by taking off attacking players and trying to defend against all out attack even though teams know our defence is no good.
Lee, Jenas cost 7m, not 9m, Bale was 5 rising to 10. Also Johnson 8.5m, Berbatov 10.9m, Lescott 5mil, Dawson 4mil, Cahill 2.5mil, Huddlestone 2mil…I know which three i’d rather have!
Everyone quotes bullshit figures about what Spurs have spent. So fucking what. How much money did we get for selling Carrick? And Kanoute? And all the other bit-part pieces of shit that we managed to get Middlesborough, Fulham and Portsmouth to stump up big money for.
It’s NET spending that counts, you spastic. Take a business course.
The fact that our players are more expensive than yours just shows we’re a bigger club not that we’ve bought our way to being better than you. We’re just better managed at every level.
You’ve got thieving genes coarsing through every vein.
Well Lee is up to his old lame tricks again , posting Moyes best buys and comparing them to Jenas to try and prove a point , sad and sadly wrong , Bale was £5 million and his price may rise depending on wether he hits certain targets and also Bent was £12 million up front and his could could also rise .
Lee also seems to think Bale is a bad buy ? i think Bale is a great buy and i can see why Man Utd were chasing him .
Here are jols best buys ..
Dimitar Berbatov £10.9 million
Pascal Chimbonda £4.5 million
Micheal Carrick £2.75 million
Aaron Lennon £1 million
Big jobs are clubs who win or have won trophies and have big crowds, think we both come in that bracket,
but the history books say that everton are the bigger club,
got a problem with it spurs, just check your trophy cabinet your just a cup side
It makes me laugh that all the Everton fans keep going on about Spurs spending but don’t take into account player sales in that period.
Carrick = 18
Mido = 6
Kanoute = 4
Mendes/Davis/Pamarot = 7
Reid = 3
I could go on, need I remind you off Simon Davies? The point is if we’d swapped Darren Bent for Carrick and 2 mill no one would have said anything. Yes we’ve invested but we’ve balanced the books well - plus we don’t have a high wage structure.
We’ve got off to a shocking start but if we put our first 11 up against yours I’d take anyones money on the outcome. Give it till the end of the season and you’ll see the full picture……
Spurs will win a trophy this year.
[quote comment=”61587″]
Darren Bent £16,500,000
Dimitar Berbatov £10,900,000
Gareth Bale £10,000,000
Didier Zokora £8,200,000
Younes Kaboul £8,200,000
Dean Richards £8,100,000
Jermaine Jenas £7,000,000
Pascal Chimbonda £5,500,000
Kevin Boateng £5,400,000
[/quote]
Another idiot who gets the transfer fee’s wrong /
Not even a contest - MOYES EASILY THE WINNER, HE WAS ALSO MANAGER OF THE YEAR 204 - VOTED BY ALL OTHER MANAGERS….JOL IS GOOD BUT NOT QUITE AS GOOD AS MOYES.
[quote comment=”61602″]
Spurs will win a trophy this year.[/quote]
I agree, but i don’t think it will be this year, it will be this century, I am sure in the coming 93 years Spurs will win a trophy, most probably Coca Cola Championship trophy!
I will take
Everton as a club and History
Moyes
Everton Fans
Everton players
over Spurs
Im not a great fan of Martin Jol as you know but please dont insult the man by comparing him with David Moyes.
Everton have no right to be used in comparison with Tottenham in any shape or form…this article must be the lowest moment in his career in England.
Dont worry Martin; for all my views on you, I would never steep so low as to favour the sour faced scotsman to you.
id rather have evertons 11 than spurs 11, however spurs have got a better squad.
(expects abuse over name)
Spurs fan here, notwithstanding all the vitriol here, I do have a great respect for Moyes.
I think we have the better players but do not have the team ethic and dynamic that Everton have developed under DM.
As for who I would rather have this is a rather silly question as clearly all those from WHL would rather have Jol and the blue scousers would want Moyes.
Pointless really.
I am also surprised as to the level of bitterness on here. I mean they are Everton, not the f%(king Woolwich.
If you look at my comment; I am not arsed about what you spend. All it tells me is that you have more money. I would not argue with that, but when the debate is supposed to be about the manager. It is what you do with the money what counts, and the point is I would rather have the Everton first choice eleven over the tottenham first choice eleven. And if you add up the cost of that first choice eleven. You will see the money Tottenham have wasted.
And for me one KPI of a manager is how well they use the funds available.
Hence Moyes is by far the better manager…
Well that has really up the ante. Thank you “faggot” for your obnoxious and extreme remarks.
If you want me to be literate over the internet then i can be. Or you can meet me face to face and we can talk about it.
[quote comment=”61607″][quote comment=”61602″]
Spurs will win a trophy this year.[/quote]
I agree, but i don’t think it will be this year, it will be this century, I am sure in the coming 93 years Spurs will win a trophy, most probably Coca Cola Championship trophy!
I will take
Everton as a club and History
Moyes
Everton Fans
Everton players
over Spurs[/quote]
Oi spammer, fizzy pop league. Who was there recently. Mug
Well, Tottenham have finished above Everton the last two years running, and also enjoyed some other successes such as the record for the most consecutive wins in Europe for an English side last season, and that was with a truly apalling start, so, as much as I rate Mr Moyes, it’s Martin Jol for me.
Ed, nice post, but you can’t just list expenditure without also listing monies recouped, else you’re only giving half the picture - but that probably wouldn;t suit your argument, would it? You’ll see Spurs are well in the black if you do, so I’m not sure what your point was? I’m also unaware of Berba & Chimbo ‘piping up and moaning’ at any stage. Perhaps you shouldn’t believe all you read in papers, what with their recent agendas linking them to Man-U and Chelsea respectively at the start of this season. I believe that’s where such stories stem from. If they were the mercenaries you try to make them seem, why are they still with us?
I would also venture to suggest team spirit is not what the team lacks. Anyone who watches a Spurs match without bias can see we have it in abundance. It is a killer instinct, winning mentality and the ability to put a game past the opposition what Spurs need to learn.
Furthermore, you can’t really use ‘players in’ as a benchmark comparison between the two when player acquisitions is NOT part of Martin Jol’s remit. Look it up; our ‘Sporting Director’ Damien Commoli is responsible for such things. Thus this is an aspect of the team where you can’t place the managers head-to-head.
Finally, what a hive of bitching and sniping this page is. A silly artical to begin with, followed up by a bunch of far sillier responses.
[quote comment=”61549″]Good question and not an easy to give an answer. I’m a spurs fan and as much as everton fans will deny the spurs hotseat is a far bigger job. Contrary to peoples thoughts Jol is not the man responsible for the purchases. This job is down to our sporting director. Jol’s job is to coach the team and coach it he has done. 5th twice in two seasons.
Moyes on the other hand has no pressure to succeed, at least not that which Jol has to work with. He has done a fantastic job at Everton and no one could deny this but i think you are comparing two completely different managerial positions. I believe both managers over the past couple of season have done fantastically well in their own right.[/quote]
Please see quote from Wikipedia;
However, he (Jermaine Jenas) was sold to Tottenham Hotspur on transfer deadline day of August 31 2005 for an initial fee of £7million, which rose to £9million after Spurs successfully qualified for European competition. He scored 12 goals in 152 appearances for Newcastle United.
I Thank You !!! (Sourthern FUCK WITS !!!)
LOL - Wikipedia’s never had an incorrect entry, has it?
Coming from a neutral, Moyes all day long.
instead of fixating on whether or not people get transfer fees wrong or banging on about net spending why not address some of the points actually being made? even taking net spending into account, spurs have spent big since before jol took over for minimal reward.you play fairly attractive football at times but havent reached the top 4.ED’s point is valid.spurs players rarely look like they’re willing to play and die for the shirt which should be the bare minimum a fan demands of his team.once you have that as a base - and it takes a skilled manager to foster than culture, then you are already a few points better off for a season.thats the true test of a manager -whether he can get the maximum out of the resources at his disposal.its obviously open to debate whether jol has done that because reports suggest that a lot of signings are out of his control.what is for certain is that moyes has done so and is continuing to do so. no contest.
Who cares…theyre both as fugly as eachother!!!!
Any fan who says that Spurs are bigger than Everton is talking rubbish. Yes Spurs are a big club but what exactly have you achieved? a couple of leagues and 8 FA cups? How long ago did you achieve these league successes? I thought Everton fans were living in the past until you Spurs fans came along. I believe it was 46 years ago that you last won the league.
Maybe Spurs believe they are the size of Newcastle. Some achievement considering they also have won nothing of any note post war.
Everton and Spurs currently have very evenly rated first elevens, but with Spurs paying over the odds for players, you cant even compare business acumen between the two managers. So what Spurs sold Carrick for £18m. Thats a profit of..ooohh…£15m if you bought him for £3m? What did Everton sell Wayne Rooney for? £27m? Not comparing the two players but it proves that you cant say Jol is any better than Moyes when it comes to the business side of things in football.
Howard Robinson
Baines Bale
Lescott King
Yobo Dawson
Neville Chimbonda
Arteta Zokora
Cahill Jenas
Gravesen Malbranque
Jagielka Lennon
Yakubu Berbertov
Johnson Bent
You Choose?
Howard
Bale
Lescott
King
Chimbonda
Arteta
Cahill
Jenas
Lennon
Berbatov
Johnson
Its pretty even to me. 6/5
Fully understand your point, Hreidarsson… but how can it possibly be no contest? Regardless of monies spent, which team has finished higher in the two full seasons BMJ has been in charge? Surely that’s the true bottom line on this one? All this resorting to talk of spending: Sunderland spent £35mil over the Summer - are they expected to be up there, too? Whichever way you want to spin it, they’re both decent chaps to have at your club, and, although I’d go for Jol based on results alone, I have nothing but respect for Moyes, whom I rate as a class manager.
Lets settle it.
Spurs 1 - 3 Everton, a couple of weeks ago.
Without a couple of Robinson saves at the end it would have been more.
Or we can just look at the league.
As a spurs fan, I think If Moyes had the money Jol’s had to spend, he would have given us a bit more satisfaction in terms of overall results. You can’t knock Jol though for the signings of Berba, Carrick, Lennon, Dawson (and in time I think Kaboul, Bale and Taraabt will prove more than moneys worth)
Though we (spurs) play more attacking and good footie at times, Moyes I don’t think would have fucked up tactically in the ways that Jol often does. However, although I’d rather have Moyes over Jol, I don’t think either are good enough to take spurs to the lengths that fulfill our potential.
COYS
Azul - four or five games does not a season make, my friend.
Furthermore, you can’t really use ‘players in’ as a benchmark comparison between the two when player acquisitions is NOT part of Martin Jol’s remit. Look it up; our ‘Sporting Director’ Damien Commoli is responsible for such things. Thus this is an aspect of the team where you can’t place the managers head-to-head.
Kym B - some fair comments but you should have read my entire post. I cited Commoli and Kemsley.
Be honest here - do Spurs fans think Jol is the man that will take them to the next level? what is the general consensus? Who would you have??
Mark Hughes and obviously Capello or Lippi would all be welcome. Ramos and Koeman are questionable I think.
Did Moyes’s tactical nouse not out do Jol?
Or was it Jol’s gashness that made him start with three up front.
Im bored, can we slag off Liverpool/Arsenal instead.
As an Everton fan, I’d def choose Moyes over Jol any day.
But to be fair to Spurs fans, I think it’s really a case of 2 different managers imposing their different styles. But one thing that is similar is that both clubs are def on the way up.
Yes, Jol has spent far more than Moyes, but the players he bought are young, talented, and evidently British. These cost a premium. Jol has also brought exciting passing football which was lost when George Graham was manager. Graham might have delivered the League Cup, but Spurs punted the ball 60 yards at every chance when he was manager. With Jol, you have one of the brightest managers in Europe and the club can only go up. 5th in 2 seasons and the board is not satisfied? What a joke.
Moyes has been astute with his purchases, and has to be one of the best managers in the transfer market. He really does his homework, and makes sure the player fits into the Everton culture before he makes the decision to buy. Of cus there were flops, but which manager doesn’t get it wrong? The only gripe I have is that football is not too exciting under him;rather, he has opted to build a well-oiled machine based on fitness, tenacity, and sheer grit, which has yielded results. With support from the board, I can see Everton possibly breakin into the top 4 in the next few seasons.
Moyes or Jol? I’d take Moyes, for the wonderful job he has done under such a shoestring budget and how he has transformed a perennial struggler and relegation candidate into European materiel. Jol has probably had a slightly easier ride but by no means is his job easy as well.
Kym B - I see your point about league positions and Jol did a decent job to take Spurs as far as he has especially with all the decisions that are being made over his head (if you believe what you read in the press). I still just feel that Moyes has done far more for Everton. If you look at what we had when he took over - an ageing squad of journeymen and veterans in the last chance saloon with very little in the way of true quality - I just feel his achievements cannot be matched but I must admit that Jol simply hasn’t had to deal with that and so this all amounts to a fairly circular argument.I guess the point is that we know what they’ve done so far - Jol has attained a fairly consistent league position in the prem while Moyes has transformed Everton from a club of relegation/lower mid table mediocrity to european contenders. Now over the next couple of years (if jol stays in the job) we will see who is better as Moyes starts to compete on more equal terms -as a manager openly aiming at european football and sneaking into the top 4.my money’s on moyesy and there’s no reason for it other than that he seems to me to bring the best out of his players on a more regular basis and has a squad of players who he will be able to keep happy far better than jol will his.
Clearly Everton fans are going with their man & Spurs’ going with Jol, so its a pointless argument. However, i would like to pick out a few points.
A lot is made of Moyes’ shoe string budget BUT while he has spent less he has also had less rewards. Spurs have got further in the cups and have been in europe for 2 consecutive seasons, whereas Moyes has achieved one season, only to under achieve the next.
Again so much is made of Moyes’ astute purchases & the pot of cash that Jol has spent but you must also look at some of the bargains that Spurs have acquired over recent seasons - Robbo £1.5m, Lennon £1.0m, Malbranque £3m, Huddleston £2.75m, Dawson £4m, Chimbonda £5m, Taarabt £1.5m, Carrick £3.5m (sold for £18.6m which is where alot of this seasons spending has come from)…..all class acts and whereas strikers are more expensive & EFC spent £8.5m on Johnson, Spurs spent £7m on Keane & on Defoe, spent £4m on Mido & sold him for £6m. So its not all about spend spend spend, Spurs have invested well, sold on players for no loss or a profit and have purchased a lot of youth.
The question that EFC fans should be asking themselves is not IS MOYES BETTER THAN JOL, it is how come of two similar clubs, with a similar sized ground, fan base, and history, it is Spurs that can generate so much more revenue and have so much more money to spend without racking up huge debts & maintain a strict & realistic wage structure. In football these days, the gate receipts & merchandising is not the biggest income, it is TV and Sponsorship. In all respects Spurs are superior are a better run club & have been able to suppoprt Jol financially better than EFC have Moyes.
As for the style of play, suffice to say that despite playing attractive attacking football, Spurs under Jol have still out performed Everton who adopt a more defensive & slightly less cultural approach.
I believe the stats speak for themselves in terms of who the better manager is.
[quote comment=”61576″]Bill Vector - All your other incessant drivel on this board is so interesting then is it? You cunt[/quote]
Jesus you are such a knob
I think moyes but you have to look at the last 2 seasons as Spudz have finnished 5th both times.
As for the cokney abuse…I would add that at the end of the day Liverpool is just a suburb of Manchester.
Oh and Ed, Dean Richards for feck sake…you forgiot to mention, Jimmy Greaves, Mike England and fecking Danny Blanchflower…nice one!!!
As an Evertonian, whilst appreciative of what Moyes has done interms of getting rid of deadwood and bringing in (and up) younger players I frustrated by his tactical negativity, something he has in common with Jol. Maybe Jol’s bigger buys have been more sucessful than Moyes’ but Moyes’ eye for a bargain is better. I think both managers are never going to be counted as real successes until silverware is won. Both teams have a history (ok maybe ancient history) of winning and more importantly winning with style. I don’t think either can match up to the ghosts of the past in today’s ridiculous market without bankrupting the clubs. So the choice is probably between which manager you would like to lead your team to 5th or 6th. Sad but true.
Moyes has won manager of the year twice.
Jol has never even come close to winning it.
Everton were in a much worse state when Moyes took over, compared to Spurs’ status when Jol got the job. Yet the two teams are now very evenly matched despite Spurs having a much larger net spend.
I don’t see how anybody can say Jol is better or has achieved more because all the facts stack up against it.
The only advantage Jol has is his sides play nicer football but even then it’s nothing spectacular… it’s not close to the style of Arsenal or Man Utd.
jimbo are you serious- “In all respects Spurs are superior are a better run club”
Enic keep Tottenham profitable, I agree. But I would not want Levy or Kemsley anywhere near my club. They just want to add as much value to the Spurs brand as possible then flog it to the highest bidder. They are businessmen and investors first and fans second.
How are you superior in all respects? That is a laughable statement. How many times have you won the league? Also, putting History to one side, how are you superior? So superior the other week weren’t you?
When Jol took over Spurs recent history looked like this………..
Sacked Hoddle in October after finishing 11th the previous season and employed pleat for the rest of the season, who lead us to 14th. We then employed Santini who left after 13 games and Jol was put in charge. You can hardly say that Jol took over a club on the up, we were reeling from one manager to another and had never finished top 6 or bottom 6 in the league.
Moyes has been at the helm for 2 more years than Jol and although you talk about the teams being very evenly matched, when we were 5th & denied 4th by a dodgy lasagne, EFC had a woeful season & ended in the bottom half after a relegation threatened season. Just because you were 6th and we were 5th last season does not make us evenly matched, Spurs have out performed Everton for Jol’s 2 seasons, in head to head match ups, in the domestic & european cups and in the league. How does that make Moyes a better manager after he has had nearly twice as long to turn the club around than Jol has had.
Two different styles
Moyes, put more emphasis on not losing and for that reason alone will never take Everton further, he will do a steady job but the Toffee fans will always feel like a bridesmaid left at the altar!
Jol, excellent impact at a club living on past glories with an often interfering boardroom to deal with in the background, they may well know how to run a business but are totally clueless when it comes to understanding football matters, like what is being a Spurs fan is all about. For my money that is to watch good…, no great football, knowing that this will often be to the team’s detriment when it comes to winning a championship. This is Jol’s predicament and more to the point does he has the ability to adjust. I am happy to give him the benefit of the doubt, another 3 years of stability will answer that question.
Based on the results of the past two seasons, it has to be Martin Jol on top each time, doesn’t it?
He has achieved this with youngsters - because the Spurs buying policy is driven more towards future profit than instant success (a reaction to Hoddles’s team of past-it players who all left for free).
With the sole exception of Edgar Davids (significantly, signed just before Spurs’ most successful season), Spurs have sorely missed the “seasoned warhorses” that Moyes has been able to (sensibly) pepper his team with. To achieve success without this ingredient is remarkable.
for all the spurs boys saying jol aint responsible for any player purchaces… WFT kinda fucked set up is that? i would be v.worried if my manager had no say over it, and what kind of manager takes it up the arse like that??? U TALK SHIT
You guys crack me up. I think you have been smoking those funny ciggys again. Jol will be gone before the end of the season. All the hype was way to high for anything but egg on Jols chin. Plus these under the table dealing for Berba baby just coming out with the dutch Lawyer bit. Sorry lads throwing money at anything that moves just won’t cut it. Bale will probably be your most consistent performer this year as Berbatov will explore greener pastures eventually.
Oh back on topic Moyes by a country mile and then some.
Jol cant be that good if the spurs board are going to sack him very soon. Would kenwright do that to moyes. Discussion over, MOYES WINS
Sadly this is a pointless argument. Both managers have walked into different clubs, with different expectations, and different pressures.
You think Everton fans expect the same as Spurs fans?
Besides the fact that this is only Jol’s 3rd season with Spurs and Moyes’ 5th with Everton.
Middlesbrough are stable too, right in the middle of the table winning nothing. Stability means nothing if you don’t progress on it.
And for “word”, before getting all irate and spitting at your screen, ask yourself if Mourinho wanted to sign Ballack and Shevchenko.
He didn’t? Oh… surely the manager behind back to back league wins doesn’t “take it up the arse like that”??
Dick…
[quote comment=”61697″]And for “word”, before getting all irate and spitting at your screen, ask yourself if Mourinho wanted to sign Ballack and Shevchenko.
He didn’t? Oh… surely the manager behind back to back league wins doesn’t “take it up the arse like that”??
Dick…[/quote]
Good point - chairmen who want to get involved on the football side have always been a menace for managers. I just thank God and Jesus Christ Almighty that the Glazers seem to have little interest in the game. Wait til Citeh have to field a few crap Thai nationals, Sven won’t stick around too long then, willy?
I like Jol a lot, as do most Spurs fans, but i believe he will be sacked at the end of the season. There is no reason to sack him as he has done some good things with the club and progressed them onto a level just below the top 4.
This is the problem that Spurs have, and there has never been a successful club that have chop and changed manager (apart from maybe Real Madrid).
If Spurs do subsequently fire Martin Jol, in my opinion Everton will have better consistency, and a better squad morale than Spurs. I think again Spurs will make the top 6, but will have a much larger fight on their hands this year than the previous 2.
Why cant we all just be friends?
Ricky lad you make the most sense of any of this lot. I agree with your whole assessment. Sometimes great expectations are a big curse.
[quote comment=”61599″]Everyone quotes bullshit figures about what Spurs have spent. So fucking what. How much money did we get for selling Carrick? And Kanoute? And all the other bit-part pieces of shit that we managed to get Middlesborough, Fulham and Portsmouth to stump up big money for.
It’s NET spending that counts, you spastic. Take a business course.
The fact that our players are more expensive than yours just shows we’re a bigger club not that we’ve bought our way to being better than you. We’re just better managed at every level.
You’ve got thieving genes coarsing through every vein.[/quote] what a wanker
[quote comment=”61571″]Moyes works for a filthy racist joke of a club in an absolute shithole of a city surrounded by monkeys. So even if he is a better manager he’s a fucking stupid cunt[/quote]
Jesus you are the most pathetic bigot COS has ever had…. take your vile racist views and shove them up your stinking anus.
[quote comment=”61706″]Why cant we all just be friends?[/quote]
because dickheads like Jesus, Anonymous and spladerunner exist. who would want to befriend racist, ignorant bigots such as them? In real life, no one. In the secret world of weblogs… still no one. That’s why not.
[quote comment=”61715″][quote comment=”61706″]Why cant we all just be friends?[/quote]
because dickheads like Jesus, Anonymous and spladerunner exist. who would want to befriend racist, ignorant bigots such as them? In real life, no one. In the secret world of weblogs… still no one. That’s why not.[/quote]
He’s been banned.
Blasphemy.
Seconded my boy. Seems like the lad had a tough upbringing
He just needed a hug.
And we cast him aside. He’s the victim.
Without doubt Moyes is the better manager. Firstly Moyes is actually a manager, hes hands on- gets out there on the training pitch and actually signs players (within budget) that benefit the squad. Jol just collects players for fun, stupid amounts of money on average players.
When talking about who is the better manager you cant help bring up the money issue- Spuds have spent an absolute fortune and not just this year over the last 3 YEARS! We have spent a third of what they have spent and have pushed them for that 5th position strongly last year.
Moyes 8.5/10
Jol 7/10. FACT.
[quote comment=”61609″]id rather have evertons 11 than spurs 11, however spurs have got a better squad.
(expects abuse over name)[/quote]
Spurs 11 1
Everton 11 3
enough said I think………….
I hope Arsenal stuff you useless bastards at the weekend.
cahill was signed for 1.7 million, his agent garnered the 250k.
ask him at palace if you want the real story.
currently mcclaren is getting a lot of abuse (before the last two games) because he was involved in the WC2006 squad - sven was boss, but mcclaren had input or he wouldnt have been there (this is the noose venables is now looking at)
remind me, jol, is this the man that praised the fighting davids did with some other player in the spurs squad? literal physical fighting?
quality management, great team spirit.
who decided to take the full squad out to a dodgy restaurant for lasagne all round? jol was manager if it was him the buck stops there, if it wasnt why did he allow it on the eve of the most important game in 16 years for spurs?
spurs and money, ‘mansion’ manchester uniteds cast offs.
classy.
is jol the manager who signed mido and tried to put a clause in his contract regarding his weight?
quality man management, quality team spirit.
lets face it, spurs were lucky to sell a porker like mido for anything let alone for a profit.
it is clearly going to take something special to save jols bacon.
the fact that jol up for the chop after such a short time is endemic of the problems at board level at spurs - everton have removed the tripe at board level and are moving forward.
lets see how spurs get on away against the trotters.
all said and done, this page has seen nothing but excuses for jol, and petty and occasional vile verbal abuse from both sides.
someone above mentioned hating the real enemy, lets refocus and consider murdoch and his influence over the game (and its referees) as the true enemy.
In answer to the bigger club thing Everton are far the bigger club. Go back to the semi final in 95 when everton fans had 3 sides of elland road and made all you yids look stupid with your pathetic support. We took over the ground and beat you to a pulp 4-1(DREAM FINAL MY ARSE) When Barmby joined Everton he said thank god i have joined a truly big club at last. Need more!!! How about 4 league title since your last one AND 9 LEAGUE TITLES TO YOUR 2. BIGGER CROWDS. ETC ETC
Big Club dont make me laugh!
[quote comment=”61680″]When Jol took over Spurs recent history looked like this………..
Sacked Hoddle in October after finishing 11th the previous season and employed pleat for the rest of the season, who lead us to 14th. We then employed Santini who left after 13 games and Jol was put in charge. You can hardly say that Jol took over a club on the up, we were reeling from one manager to another and had never finished top 6 or bottom 6 in the league.
Moyes has been at the helm for 2 more years than Jol and although you talk about the teams being very evenly matched, when we were 5th & denied 4th by a dodgy lasagne, EFC had a woeful season & ended in the bottom half after a relegation threatened season. Just because you were 6th and we were 5th last season does not make us evenly matched, Spurs have out performed Everton for Jol’s 2 seasons, in head to head match ups, in the domestic & european cups and in the league. How does that make Moyes a better manager after he has had nearly twice as long to turn the club around than Jol has had.[/quote]
Moyes took over a team that had not won for 2 months and had 9 games to save them. Most had Everton to go down at the point he took over. Everton were safe after only 7 games.
This was the team he inherited:
Simonsen; Pistone, Stubbs, Weir, Unsworth, Clarke; Gascoigne, Gemmill, Linderoth; Radzinski, Moore.
I really don’t think Jol’s situation is comparable.
Nick, a really good comment. Good stats and you say it exactly the way it is. If that side was in the Premier League today it would be in deep deep trouble.
Everton were destined for relegation before Moyes turned up at Goodison and turned things around. Until Jol has had way more time, its an insult to compare Jol’s meagre achievements with Moyes’ turnaround of Everton.
[quote comment=”61587″]
Darren Bent £16,500,000
Dimitar Berbatov £10,900,000
Gareth Bale £10,000,000
Didier Zokora £8,200,000
Younes Kaboul £8,200,000
Dean Richards £8,100,000
Jermaine Jenas £7,000,000
Pascal Chimbonda £5,500,000
Kevin Boateng £5,400,000
[/quote]
ED YOU COMPLETE MUG!!!! MARTIN JOL DID NOT AND WOULD NOT EVER BUY DEAN FUCKING RICHARDS!! i hate people who come on here and give it all that, thinking they know the ins and outs of football, slapping down figures and dates, when really they’re just reading ‘tottenham hotspur’s most expensive signings since sergei rebrov’ on fucking wikipedia.
at the end of the day, spurs are a lot better than everton, will finish a lot higher, have high ambitions unlike the mid table aspirations of the latter scouse outfit, and without a shadow of a doubt their manager is and will always be under MUCH more pressure than his everton counterpart.
not to mention he also did not buy jermaine jenas… oh and not to mention that we make our money because of our astounding, dedicated world fanbase, and extremely good business sense by making large amounts of money by selling second rate players.
enough.
jimbo is the only one speaking sense here.
Lots of points to consider there: Two good managers with strong arguments for both, as well as a lot of bollocks, too. There’s no point in repeating either; I’ll just leave it to the actual experts:
David Moyes has won two (2) LMA Manager of the Year awards, whereas Martin Jol has won zero (0), LMA Manager of the Year awards.
That’s Moyes 2 Jol O
andy, you are living in some kind of cacooned dream world, in which Spurs are the all singing all dancing fantasy that allows every creature to breathe. Basically you are a fool if you think Spurs have bigger ambitions than Everton. Everton have a bigger history than Spurs and have won more than Spurs can even comprehend. Just because you are a London club doesn’t entitle you to a history.
The usage of the 2 words, “worldwide fanbase” makes me shiver when used in the same sentence as the word “Spurs”. You only have money because you charge £48 a ticket and the fact that your season tickets are the second most expensive in the Premier League.
You think having money also makes you the largest club in the entirity of the planet Earth? Shall we try that argument against Wigan Athletic? I would have a bet than Whelan could easily finance most Premier League clubs, yet he chose Wigan because they have a massive history with a huge worldwide fanbase.
I have a lot of friends, some of whom are Spurs fans and they give Spurs a good name. However some of you need to either stop dreaming, and stop whinging about beinging a big club and actually help your club be where it wants to be! The way some of you Spurs fans act its like your already there. Wrong, im afraid its only just getting started.
COYB
THE MOYESIAH!!!
calm down eyh calm down
andy - “ED YOU COMPLETE MUG!!!! MARTIN JOL DID NOT AND WOULD NOT EVER BUY DEAN FUCKING RICHARDS!! i hate people who come on here and give it all that, thinking they know the ins and outs of football, slapping down figures and dates, when really they’re just reading ‘tottenham hotspur’s most expensive signings since sergei rebrov’ on fucking wikipedia.” I’m sure ED just forgot to erase Dean Richards from a list of players, all of whom bar Richards, Jol signed. Technically Jol doesnt sign anyone as we have already established. But regardless of that, why are you just responding to the one thing in the post that is out of place. I hate it when people can’t argue football so just pick up on type-os and irrelevant things like that. By the way check your own facts you part-time “fan”- Jenas was signed during the Jol era. Come on you Gooners, do us all a favour on Saturday. Andy - “enough” - lol, you really are a nobjockey so pipe down in future
Arteta 2.2 million
Cahill 1.5 million (not 2.5 as others have stated)
Where on earth do you pick up bargins like that? Ok Beattie, Koldrup and Davies weren’t the best buys in the world but they were all sold for two thirds or above of what they were brought for, its not like Moyes dropped a complete rebrov is it!
Point is, as Moyes is showing, buying players for top cash, Yakubu, Johnson is easy. even lescott cost decent money given he had no prem experience. But thats all Jol ever has to do where Moyes can now, and only now, start paying top cash as well as keeping an eye out for the odd bargin.
I think now we will see Everton overtake spurs as the team most likely to break into the top four each year, its not like we haven’t done it before with a far worse team.
Interestingly, (ish) The right result league which tries to correct bad reffing decisions to reflect a league where ref’s weren’t spanners. Their table last season had Everton in fifth four points behind liverpool and 10…10 points ahead of spurs.
Everton even got mugged of two points by the ref on the last day of the season against chelsea which on its own would of meant us finishing fifth.
One thing I will say for Martin Jol though, he deserves a much better board than he has, not in money terms plainly. Just in terms of support. The way the Spurs board has acted is shameful. Its no wonder that spurs never win anything with all that money with a board as fickle as that.
Its got to be Moyes! Plus, any man who appears on TV wearing a cardigan and slippers to discuss finishing the league in a champions league spot with a team that had pistone, stubbs, weir and hibbert as its back four! Just should not be messed with!
I like Jol because he has a big chin and talks funny… but then again our fella Moyesy has great sandy coloured hair and he talks in a funny accent as well….tough to choose really!!
Tell you what…. first one to get a cup is the winner!….. now I can’t be fairer than that.
Jol’s sooo good he’s going to be fired next week. The problem with Spurs is the fans, they get on the players back’s far too early. One stray pass at White Hart Lane and your career’s over as far as Spurs fans are concerned.
Moyes all day long.
This debate started well but as per usual all the armchair supporters cam out with all the usual cack.
I’m a blue and proud, I love Moyes, he’s done a fantastic job in short space of time (yes, 5 years is a short space of time) and I’ll be happy if he can take Everton onto another level although developments off the pitch need to take place first.
I have the same respect for Jol, I think he’s a top Manager who, like Moyes, still has alot to learn. Jol has built a great side and with some time given by the board it’ll develop I’m sure into a regular top 4 side over the next 2-3 seasons.
All in all, 2 great managers, a draw, both sides in the top 4 in the not too distant future.
Everton’s excuss of not winning MORE than 1 FA cup and obtaining 1 Champions League spot over the last 12 years is that our managers have had all but a bag of beans to spend on players.
Spurs haven’t even managed that over the last decade and they are a club who have almost always had money to buy player AND are based in fashionable London, what’s your excuss other than poor management and player selection?
Berbatov will have the second season blues this season, epecially as he has got one eye on moving to a bigger club - Perhaps Everton should put in a bid come January.
But then again, you can keep your usual luxury players as in all honesty they never really come up with the goods do they. Is it really almost half a century since you won the last of your two English Championship trophies?
Bigger club than Everton - Dream on - you are just the Newcastle of the South. Got a few quid to spend so think your club are the boll0cks.
Bill v,you only say that because its not your team.common lad,join in again,there is more than 4 teams in the league mate,i know sky are trustworthy but they do have the blinkers on when it comes to anyone other than the medias big four.
Just banter lad!#
As an evertonian i do have bias,but i really rate Jol, i think he is a modern game manager.But looking at money to spend,quality of signings and the pull the club has as far as facilities and location,jol has it a lot easier.
Majority of foreign players want to live in london,that has helped jol no end, hes had way more money to spend,and white hart lane is a decent ground,and presume the training facilities are good too.
Moyes has lost out on players who dont want to live in the legendary north west,the ground although a traditional electric footie atmosphere,it doesnt seem a modern day sports ground.Moyes’ budget has been limited,but we have international quality thrughout the squad as well now,with less to spend,our new training facilities are the best in europe,a new ground is on the horizon,we are the only team in 11 years to win the fa cup outside of the ‘top 4′,we are the only team to break into cl place,and dont give me it was a poor season,cos if anyone else had taken4th spot you’d say it was deserved.
Overall two managers who will go onto to achieve even better things,who are looking to achieve the same things, and will take the two clubs onto a level where we will challenge any and every team in europe and the league.coyb
One more point.
There are very few managers who wont get sacked and the only way they will leave is if they walk.
Moyes will have to walk,he’ll never get sacked now.
Fergie and wenger as well as hughes pop into mind.
Jol though im afraid would. Something to think about eh!
Glad you mates finally showed up. It was getting a little fickle around here. Glad no mention of Dogs were uttered.
Your right Winning Post. It will be on Moyes time table when he does call it quits. Unlike Martin that has to peer in the paper to check if he’s getting the thumbs up.
WHAT’S ALL THIS ABOUT DAVID MOYES BUILDING A SIDE ON A SHOE STRING BUDGET HAHAHA.
FIRSTLY -
HE’S STILL NOT ACHIEVED ANYTHING - NEVER REACHED THE LATTER STAGES OF ANY COMPETITION - JUST WHAT HAS DAVID MOYES DONE? HE MAY HAVE BUILT HIS OWN TEAM - BUT HASN’T EVERY MANAGER !
SECONDLY -
THIS ‘SHOE-STRING’ BUDGET TAG AMAZES ME. MOYES HAS ALREADY SPENT NEAR 80 MILLION. THATS AN AWFUL LOT FOR A TEAM WHO’VE STILL YET TO DO ANYTHING.
TO ALL EVERTON FANS - GET A GRIP. AFTER SPENDING CLOSE TO A 100 MILLION - I’D EXPECT CHAMPIONS LEAGUE FOOTBALL.
CAN HE DELIVER IT - NAAAH
Wow, thanks for your contribution numbnuts.
See that key labelled ‘Caps Lock’?
Hit it once and continue.
And lastly, do you like dogs? If so, whats your favourite breed?
Great site lads, keep up the good work yada yada.
All neutral fans I have spoke to think Everton are bigger than spurs.
Spurs have won only 2 league titles
Spurs have not finished in the top 2 in over 40 years
Spurs have not finished in the top 4 in the premiership
Anyone who looks at things sensibly can see everton are much bigger.
I
I work with a Tottenham supporter and I asked him this question and he said he would rather have Moyes any day of the week…. I agreed with him and so did a Liverpool supporter who was listening into our conversation (although I didn’t ask for his stupid opinion) …. another guy chipped in and said he would prefer Martin jol as a manager.
So there you have it then …..conclusive proof
Everton 3 Tottenham 1 .
Just like the last time we met.
Statistics don’t lie !! …… lets end this debate now and all agree that Moyes is better than Jol …..!!
I cant beieve how people can compare two completeley different manager. It’s like comparing A goalkeeper to a forward.
But as to who I would have if i had to pick, it has to be moyes. He is stable, going in the right direction, got a great team spirit and most importantly, fully backed my his superiors…..can tottenham say the same about Jol?? No to that.
So, fresh from another 3-1 defeat at home (well done Arsenal), will you reconsider your decision on Jol being better?
I don’t care about Jol or Spurs i care about Everton and how bug eyed moyes is never going to take my Everton any further this chump never learns from his mistakes he is tactically inept and too predictable moyes has a job for life as long as kenwright is in charge why oh why didn’t you accept his resignation after the Bucharest game bill you rat?When moyes took over @ EFC his team used to fight,close down be full of running pressurise the opposition until the very last second in games 5 years down the line we play long balls to diddy men who are never oing to out jump or win headers against big cetre half’s for 90 minutes believe me this is Moyes choice for HIS team to play this way example maybe against Metalist Wessels starts the game off passing the ball to his defenders feet that soon got fucked off for route one shenanigans and without Arteta are exposed for the 1 man team we really are sure we have a better starting eleven compared to a few years ago but the so called brand of football is atrocious(although on our day we can play beautiful football but how often do we see this?) as a famous band have sung i told you once before that we should settle for a draw that’s what moyes is all about i mean @ home nearly every game its lets go a goal up (if they haven’t slotted one before us)and defend for our lives?????????Oh but if the opposition equalize well a point is better than no points?? fuck off we will go no further under this man while we are in a half decent state we need to fuck him off NOW.
Martin lol would be better David Moyes has not got a clue on a good player look how long he had mcfadden sitting on the shelves he hasnt noticed the talent in our youth teams but keeps brnging new ones in.
apparently levvy prefers moyes!