Leeds United Go To Elland Back Over 15 Points
by jakepjohnson on April 16th, 2008
| 241 words |
Just as you thought their fall from grace was complete and they were focusing on climbing back up the football league, Leeds United are still refusing to let things lie.
Seemingly taking a leaf from the Sheffield United book of ‘How To Fight A Court Case You Won’t Win And Tarnish Your Reputation At The Same Time’, the Yorkshire club are still fighting the Football League for their 15 point deduction which occurred back in August 2007.
An independent tribunal considering the penalty is set to start today. The three-man panel reviewing the deduction is expected to make their ruling before Leeds travel to Millwall on the 19th of April, and if they receive all 15 points back, a win at The New Den would clinch 2nd place and automatic promotion back to The Championship.
If that were to happen League One promotion rivals Carlisle United and Doncaster Rovers have already said they will start legal proceedings and may more could follow suit.
However, the chances of that happen is slim but, according to leading sports lawyer Richard Cramer, it is still possible for Leeds:
A few weeks ago, I thought it was bleak, but having seen the legal documents, I think the prospects have improved. I think there’s probably a 25-30% chance of winning.
They may carve it up - they might say ‘Well hold on, 15 points is too much, we’ve got to give them something’ and bring it down to eight, seven or six.”
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Tagged Under: Carlisle, doncaster, league one, leeds united
Bryan Higgins - April 16th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
1. What possible reasons could Doncaster and Carlisle have that would stand up in court ? could it be … “we would have played better if we thought Leeds could get any points back “. I just can’t see that standing up in any court. They’re just trying to influence the outcome of the arbitration in their favour.
2. Ken Bates has agreed to a private arbitration under duress, this means if the outcome does not satisfy him he could still take it to the high courts and have the public hearing he originally requested. Keep going Ken, we all want to hear the FL’s real reasoning behind their descision, excluding Lord MawHinney and cronies.
3. If the descision stands will Bournemouth and Luton (and others in the future) get the same penalty ? Not a chance, because it would force smaller clubs out of the FL and possibly ruin them altogether. Not good for the FL’s coffers.
E Walker - April 16th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
As a Sheffield United Support who was stitched up last year in the West Ham fiasco I know what it is like to feel cheated. The Foorball League is doing to Leeds what the Premier League and FA did to us last year. The penalty is unjustified and could lead to the likes of Rotherham, Luton and Bournemouth going out of existance. Other League 1 clubs should have realised ‘Blue’ Ken would not give in and should have budgeted for Leeds getting some points back. If they had gained more points on the field they wouldnt be whinging.
Andrew Ingleby-delube - April 16th, 2008 at 5:34 pm
I can’t see why or how any club could appeal as Leeds have not broken any rules . the football league refused arbitration in september and asked other competing clubs to vote on the fate of a rival. anyone would vote against a rival. leeds also failed in their bid in october we have waited 6 months for arbitration that was was finally refused and we then went to the high court and finally the FL decided “Oh Leeds realy mean it” and then decided on arbitration.
The decision of the panel is final and determines wether the League acted outside their rules in imposing a sanction that was not in their rule book in a second season after imposing on in the year of the original “infringement” that they caused by not accepting the CVA alongside the HMRC. therefore it was purely a personal vendetta against Mr. Bates and the club and fans suffered. Leeds have earned “On the field” automatic promotion.
Trevor - April 16th, 2008 at 7:27 pm
there was no reason except spite to deduct the 15, the agreed offer was better than the one that did have a cva, the turkeys (the other FL clubs) wouldn’t vote for Christmas (not deducting points from a rival) - we deserve a level playing field nuff said
- if the other clubs don’t like that then maybe the league should introduce a handicap league (Man U start on -20, Arsenal on -15?) with Carlisle on +20 - COWARDS who don’t want a fair fight.
Michael Feary - April 16th, 2008 at 8:49 pm
It does seem that the FL have acted outside of their own rules. If they were 100% certain they’d done everything by the book then it would have gone to arbitration early in the season. Instead they have tried to drag it out as long as they could only to turn down a public hearing. Why is this, do they have something to hide?
Incidentally all the teams who are now quick to moan about Leeds getting points back were even quicker voting to get the 15 points taken off. They obviously knew at the beginning of the season that Leeds would be one of the best teams in the league. They were (and still are) trying to increase their chances as they obviously aren’t good enough to do it on a level playing field
Laura - April 17th, 2008 at 7:20 pm
Leeds should not get there points bck cause
all they do is fuckin foil and then it not fair then
the other team
all the local teams and that will go up wallwith the fa
I Support Doncastedr ROVERS
Dave penny - April 17th, 2008 at 7:23 pm
Well i was the doncaster rovers manger and the leeds should it not get there points bck
Drfc are the bst
James T - April 18th, 2008 at 12:10 pm
Lookat, there are a few fair comment here and like any arguement theres two sides to it but lets be honest, whay do the FL have to drag everything out and then only offer a ‘private’ hearing where if they were in the right they’d have agreed to a public hearing and had it resolved months ago…
Anyway if leeds do get the points back (which we should) carlisle and doncatse would be biggots for startign legal campaigns againt the decision after they all voted against leeds in the first place, when clearly they knew we would be a top 3 team at worst (which is exactly the way it has worked out) so anyone that would vote against leeds and then claim they’ve been wronged should take a long hard look……..!!!
phil padgett - April 19th, 2008 at 9:35 am
I have never heard so much rubbish talked as that coming from the pathetic, running scared, clubs who could drop behind Leeds if the15 points are returned.
Is the whole world forgetting that Leeds have physically earned every single point on the football pitch - not in a court room.
Every point has been earned by playing football.
Leeds don’t want to be given any points - they just don’t want 15 points to be stolen.
Tim P. - April 19th, 2008 at 6:55 pm
So Swansea are crowned champions? 2 games to go, Leeds get their points back…………………..Do the maths!
bozzy - April 19th, 2008 at 7:55 pm
THEY SHOULD GET FUCK ALL BACK TAKE ANOTHER 15 POINTS OFF THEM INFACT PUT THEM IN NON LEAGUE WANKERS THEY DESERVE EVERTHING THEY GET & KEN BATES WOT A TOSSER .
diego - April 21st, 2008 at 12:33 am
bozzy you are a small minded fool who has to rely on using bad language to prove your own ignorance.
Leeds may or may not get the 15 points back, but to be honest I am sure that all 15 points will be awarded back. After all Leeds were not to blame for all of this stupidity. Leeds did not have much choice on how the came out of administration that was down to KPMG. Yes I have to agree that if it had been a team from Lancashire who play in red the outcome may have been different, and maybe it does have a lot to do with Mr. Bates but the FA and Football League should punish clubs for things they can do something about not clubs who do not and did not have a choice.
Raymondo - April 23rd, 2008 at 12:53 pm
Going into adminstration last season and getting 10 points deducted when Leeds knew they were being relegated anyway was unscrupulous by Mr Bates, thinking he could avoid the points deduction in league one. Personally, though not a Leeds fan, I was rooting for them to beat the drop. It was the way Mr Bates was able to start up again as if nothing had happened and with creditors getting a fraction of their debts, that stinks and had a different consortium taken over at Leeds, I don’t Leeds would have had a further deduction to start this season. Mind you, I think Leeds will get the points back & even though it’s supposed to be an independent tribunal, the FA / Football League haven’t got the bottle when it is threatened by the ‘big’ teams (and yes, Leeds are still a big team). Had it not been Mr Bates …. Leeds would have a lot more sympathy.
danny brad - April 24th, 2008 at 8:57 am
Leeds were gonna get kicked out of the league but took the 15 points punishment so they could stop in . now they changed their minds. i wonder if leeds will change their minds and pay back all of the money bates and co nicked from there creditors . if its in the leagues hands i would demote leeds to conference just like they did with boston, remember. by the way yes i am a carlisle fan but if leeds do get their points back there should be no appeals, just lessons learned.
peter k - April 26th, 2008 at 10:38 am
Well you Know what having read all the comments isnt it so easy to see that the fotball league are so wrong and they are tryin to hide something and as for all the legal treaths from all league one clubs, give it a break and start playing quality football to earn your rewards not by back stabbing (remeber what you voted for?) sore loosers we won 88 points so far by winning games
craig s LUFC - April 26th, 2008 at 5:39 pm
as i see we have alot of doncaster n the rest of the sore loser’s on here leeds fans dont expect to get the 15 points back cause we’ll go up trough the play off’s. so to all the fans who are moaning about leeds do me a fucking favour and moan when BECKFORD knocks you out of the playoffs NOW FUCK OFF.
James T - April 28th, 2008 at 1:05 pm
Look lessons do have to be learned but we’re not looking for anything we dont deserve, and in fairness it’s nothing any other club wouldn’t do if they were in the same position…Im sure leeds didn’t want any points taken in the first place but it’s not up to the fans, it’s bates that’s runnin the club, all we can do is support…but listen if we dont get the points back we’ve proved that we were good enough because we finished 6th after starting -15, and if we do it’s only right becasue thats the correct league position according to performance…i hate whenever politics takes over football but lets be honest, leeds cant out of this in a good light whatever happens so appeals, hearings, crap talk aside weve proved that were rebuilding and good enough for promotion so let it be….
Anonymous - April 28th, 2008 at 3:26 pm
i think leeds should get them back they dont deserveto loose them
WhiteEric - April 28th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
Leeds took advantage of a loop hole in the law by taking the 10 point penalty last season when they knew it would have no effect on them whatsoever, thus rendering the penalty meaningless.
Sadly for Leeds fans, loopholes in laws are not fair game to be taken advantage of. You shouldn’t have had 25 points taken off you, the 10 point penalty from last season should have been transferred to this season and that is what will happen in this case. Hence, come Thursday Leeds will be 5 points better off than they are now.
James T - April 29th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Whether or not we get the points back is evidently gonna lead to bad press for leeds, this is why if they get them back people say they couldn’t do it without them (which is crap) and if they dont they say we were in the wrong but the bottom line is….the FL need to make a decision, this thing is either a rule or it’s not, make your mind up but be prepared for future similarities…
Johnser - Stoke Fan - April 30th, 2008 at 11:04 am
as a nutreal i see this thing going only one way, the football league know bates stance on it and know that he said its all or nothing, that he not prepared to accept anything less that 15, its either a rule or its not so what i think is the football league will ofer 10 or somethiong knowing that bates will reject it, this then leads to people saying ‘fair play to the football league, at least they offered something back, hey knew they were wrong and tried to make amends’ and will also lead to peaople saying ‘well what club wouldnt want an extra 10 points, leeds are just being greedy now, fuck them’…..has to happen